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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Track Rod Ends

Bearing in mind my existing are showing signs of perishing, where is the best place to source new ones? I know they are quite cheap, but I would like the best I can get bearing in mind the short life reputed of some rubber parts.
C Martin

Moss list two different varieties. One is listed as aftermarket, the other, we can only assume, is OE spec.

The difference is cost is £4.90 for the early rack, and £1 for the later rack.
Dave O'Neill 2

try Vintage and Collectors Car Spares. They stock original OE parts with decent rubber. Not as cheap as Moss though. John Davies 01724 784230 E: johndavis.vintage@btinternet.com
Bob Beaumont

I fitted new TREs on my Frogeye last year during its (continuing) build up. The rubber boots have split and completely decayed into small pieces since then. Considering it hasn't been out of the garage in that time this does seem to be rather unsatisfactory.
GuyW

The same thing happened to some new ones I put on my MGB. I emailed a complaint to the supplier with photos of the split boots and they apologised and sent me two new boots, which they said were made of a better material. We shall see.

Mike Howlett

Thanks for responses all, looks like my assumption may be correct. I've emailed John Davis as this sounds the best idea. Failing this maybe its Moss.
Colin
C Martin

Mike, if they had replacement ones with better material, why not sell people those in the first place?
G Lazarus

Colin , are you after the tie rod ends complete or the dust boots, If it's just the boots there are polyeurethane / nolathene replacements available--
You should be able to get them from somewhere that sells aftermarket suspension bushes or ebay-------------

willy
William Revit

https://www.ebay.com/b/Car-Truck-Tie-Rod-Linkages-for-MG/33593/bn_1452282
William Revit

Hi

I had the similar experience as Guy and Mike - TRE boots perishing in about a year with a car in the garage. I got replacement TRE rubber boots only (was not going to replace a virtually unused TRE) from Leacey Classics, but looks like widely available from suppliers such as MGB Hive, ESM Minors etc. Part number I think 7H3762.

Note ESM's the product descriptions of their standard and improved boots:

http://www.morrisminorspares.com/steering-c92/steering-all-c93/track-rod-tie-rod-end-rubber-dust-seal-mmc-branded-p1238269

http://www.morrisminorspares.com/steering-c92/steering-all-c93/track-rod-tie-rod-end-rubber-dust-seal-7h3762-p831423

Cheers
Mike
M Wood

You could do yourself a favour and buy the no-greaseable sort. Don't bother with Rhino Rubber boots especially with reuseable TREs.

The TREs I have on now are longer lasting, well more than 6-months at least.

From my stock of rubbish-rubber photos, what they can look like after 6 months of light winter use. -


Nigel Atkins

Its interesting that the rubber boots on the two spare racks I have are in almost perfect condition. The came from a scrapped frogeye and Mk111 sprite many many moons ago and could even be the originals. They are the regreasable type so not worn. There's progress!
Bob Beaumont

Uhm, sun's got to me, should have been -

You could do yourself a favour and buy the no[n]-greaseable sort. Don't bother with Rhino Rubber boots especially with [greaseable] TREs.
Nigel Atkins

9 months since fitting and the only "use" its had is to be rolled in and out of the garage a couple of times!

GuyW

I hope to get a pair from John Davis, failing that I shall buy a pair of the better ones from Moss (why do they sell inferior ones, why would you buy inferior ones?) and also buy a pair of boots from ESM to keep in stock. Since I don't know how long the existing ones have been on the car but longer than 12 years I think its best to change rather than remove, replace rubber and then refit.
C Martin

“why do they sell inferior ones, why would you buy inferior ones?”

Possibly because some other suppliers only sell cheap ones, so they have to be able to compete.
Dave O'Neill 2

If they are failing that quick without any use it makes you wonder how many are sitting on suppliers shelves disintegrating before they come out of the box. Could be quite expensive for a big supplier if they have to bin a load of stock.

With regard to stocking poor items when there are better alternatives it has been said on here before that however good a product is the suppliers are only prepared to pay a certain price and if you wont/can't drop to that they don't want it, probably as Dave says because they feel they can't compete otherwise.

Trev
T Mason

Looking at that photo of mine (the speckles are dust,btw) I think there is something not quite right about the TREs anyway. There seems much less space between the steering arm and the TRE itself, as if the taper on the pin is undersized so it has pulled up too far into the tapered hole in the steering arm. The rubber boot, before it disintegrated, looks as if it was overly compressed, at least compared to the photo that Nigel posted a litle earlier.

I had trouble with these TREs from the start. The first pair were badly made with an oversized thread tapped into the end for the track rod to screw into - far too much slack in the threads for a safety critical item like that. After complaining, I was sent a second pair that they said thay had selected, and they were much better.

But that now lists as three separate quality faults on an item as simple as a TRE! It makes me wonder about the quality of the steel they used as well. I think I will change them.
GuyW

Trev,
I guess items like this are made in very small factories that try and cut their costs as much as possible, almost irrespective of who they are supplying to or at what price. The likelyhood is that the rubber parts are made somewhere in someone's back yard and bought by the bucket full by the "engineering" shop that do the machining of blank castings bought from yet another small supplier. No one takes responsibility for overall quality control.

Order numbers are too low for the manufacturers to get continuity of work so there is little incentive to up their game at all, as long as they can off load that particular batch into the supply chain which very likely has several more links before the parts arrive on a UK stores shelf.

The only way this gets improoved is if the UK business is prepared to establish and support their supply chain right back to the manufacturer with guaranteed prices and quantities. That itself puts the price up and whilst there are others prepared to accept whatever is produced without questioning quality or origin, the better quality focussed businesses will always be undercut.
GuyW

"why would you buy inferior ones?" -

Tight-fisted classic car owners, who appear to be in the majority, it doesn't matter to some of them as their vehicles are basically static displays with little road use and now no worries about a minimum standard for MoTs.

If there's sufficient demand and a profit can be made then suppliers will look to provide to this demand and make a profit, that's their business. However, if there is insufficient demand because there is a much cheaper alternative that sells in much greater quantity there's little point even investigating feasibility.

A poor quality part will be replaced more often so the cycle continues.

I'm sure if you ask a supplier that has a higher priced alternative to the "cheap" parts the sales of the "cheap" parts will be in the multiples in comparison, that is real life customer demand, most when ordering would have seen the alternative part.



Nigel Atkins

Nigel, you are right about customers habitually choosing the lowest priced items. But the problem is that often one cannot visually tell items apart on quality, especially if having to buy remotely (internet, telephone, mail order) And higher price of itself doesn't necesarily equate to higher quality.

The ones who do know about quality are the manufactureres. The chap making up the rubber to pour into the moulds knows fine well that adding a few handfulls of wood ash from the household stove into the mix will bulk it up and make him more TRE boots to sell but he has more pressing priorities than how well that item will perform on a car in a wealthy country many thousands of miles away.
GuyW

Guy,
I don't remember if there's any or much difference in size but my TREs are the Triumph type.

It's annoying about the boots at least because it seems MMC at least can get better quality and I remember someone posting here about getting seals of any size and quantity, made by a British company, so imagine they could perhaps do quantities for a larger supplier, perhaps grow business by supporting each other and being able to make decent products at reasonable sales prices for a reasonable profit to the businesses so they can invest and continue, just imagine . . .

you, you may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one, I hope someday all will join us, and the classic world will be as one . . .
Nigel Atkins

I'm not so sure tight fisted owners are the problem. All retailers of anything these days are of the opinion that everybody wants everything as cheap as possible and to hell with the consequences, but people soon get fed up with the rubbish if it keeps happening. Most people will realise at some point that replacing a cheap part three or four times works out more expensive than one good part. When you look at the amount of money spent on classics I don't think generally people are tight fisted.

Trev
T Mason

Trev,
some owners (many?) are happy to pay lots for cosmetics because that's what they want out of their ownership but would much sooner pay £3 for a functional part than £10. If they actually used the classic for any mileage then yes they'd soon discover the possible (often?) false economy but they don't. Many of these owners have more than one (practically static) classic and still think beer's two bob a pint or ought to be (you should hear them moan about prices at the shows) but offer them a bit of fashionable bling and the price is worth it to them.

Here I will say, each to their own and what anyone one wants to do with their classics and their money is their business and as long as they don't moan about prices to parts quality they can carry on as much as they like as far as I'm concerned - I will moan about them causing me problem though! :)

It's very easy, look at parts that have "cheap" and an "OE" alternative and ask the suppliers how many they sell of each - what's your guess for the ratio (no I don't know and haven't asked).

Nigel Atkins

I replaced the rear drop links last year, and I have a nasty feeling the clunk I can hear over bumps is due to them failing already :(
C MADGE

Just to close the thread, I got a pair of OE TRE's from John Davis at VCCS, thanks to Bob B for the link. As you say, not as cheap as Moss but as I want to do this just the once it must be better value.
Colin
C Martin

Colin, thanks for reporting back.
Nigel Atkins

Forgot to mention, my TRE's came in a fairly battered box in blue and white proclaiming "British Leyland Genuine parts"
Colin
C Martin

I have just been sorting through a box of invoices for various parts for the Frogeye and came across one for the TREs that the rubber boots perished on so badly (photo earlier in this thread, dated 21 April. I had forgotten who supplied them but when I saw I immediately thought, I recognise that name!

Turns out that the replacement boots I bought last week as recommended by Mike Wood back in April, came from the same supplier! I did go for their "better quality" offering this time but as they are not a supplier that I generally use, its quite a coincidence! Or ironic!
GuyW

This thread was discussed between 20/04/2019 and 21/05/2019

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