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MG MG Y Type - Clamping JackAll Rams

In order to not distorte the JackAll rams of a Y-Type, there surely must have distance pieces been used "ex works" between the chassis and the semi-circular clamps.
Has anyone got the correct thickness of any such spacers? At present, I am using stacks of plain washers for packings.

Thank you

Anton Piller

Are these your rear rams Anton? I would suggest that you take them to a shop where they can bend them better around the outside of the ram as I am not sure you would get a good enough grip using the packing washers.

Having checked my car there are no distance pieces on either front or rear rams.

Paul

Paul Barrow

Paul
It's the front rams and the camps are definitely not "home made". They are made of pressed steel with a re-inforcement rip between the fastening holes and the radius fits perfect. They are just a bit shallow as it looks - see attachment.
I will have to search the web for two substitutes.....
Anton

Anton Piller

Anton,the real question here is - what makes you feel that the outer ram tube could distort?

The outer ram is a very sold item, which looks like it's made from drawn tubing, with a wall thickness in excess of 3 mm. I have no data to tell me how much clamping load spread over a 2" -3" wide clamp would be needed to distort a sturdy tube like this by manual means. It could be that the clamp bolts or nuts would strip out their threads before the tube would be distorted, but I could be wrong.

My rams do not have packers under the clamps, nor are there any shown in the workshop manual. We need to have a fairly high clamp load because it's carrying the weight of at least half of the car when the Jackall system is in use. If you put packers under the clamps, you may not get the requisite clamping action, and you could find that the jack will simply slide up inside the clamps as you jack up your car. Not a big help!

There is no requirement that the inner tube fits snugly inside the outer tube - in fact the inner tube diameter is quite a lot less than the outer and sealing is achieved by means of a flexible seal between the inner tube and the end cap of the outer tube.

My son is a mechanical engineer so I will see if he has any data about how much weight it would take to distort a Jackall tube - I'd be surprised if it could be done with manually with a spanner!
N Wakeman

Neil is correct, there are no packing pieces - just use the torque setting in the Tech Centre & the rams won't move.

I did see one car where the rams and plates were powder coated & would slip, but a square of emery paper between the ram & plate fixed that.

Don't forget to adjust the ram heights - left/right & front/rear - so the car is level when fully jacked on all four rams.

Cheers

Tony
A L SLATTERY

Thank you, Gentlemen

I will try check with some Y-Types in Switzerland, which means some travelling to do.
I suspect that my clamps might be of a different type of car.
Will keep you posted :o)
Anton
Anton Piller

Enjoy visiting Y Typer Anton - any excuse is a good one! Take your brakets with you.

Paul
Paul Barrow

Hi Anton,

Here's a picture of my car (that made me realise how dirty it is).

As far I can see on the picture your clamp is correct and there is not a large gap and no spacers

Willem van der Veer

Do you have a gap there Willem? I am not seeing one, at least not as big as Anton's appears to be.

Paul
Paul Barrow

Anton,

Rest assured that your Jackall ram clamp is correct (or at least the front one, which you have pictured, is correct). Here is a picture of mine - it doesn't have any packing pieces and there is a gap of about 3 mm between the clamp section that is welded to the chassis and the loose section that is bolted to the permanent affixed part. This gap would be variable, depending on whether there is a gap at the other end of the clamp, which I can't see. For example, if yours is bolted up tight at the front, the gap at the rear will be larger.

I can't find anything data to prove it but I don't think you could possibly squash or distort the ram tube which has a very thick wall, or distort the saddle part of the clamp which is also made of 6 mm thick steel with a reinforcing rib.

I'd recommend that you bolt it all together, no spacers, do it up tight(as per the torque settings that Tony Slattery referred to)and all will be well.


N Wakeman

Tony, Willem & Neil

Thank you for your feedbacks and photos. My saddle pieces are tightened evenly and the gaps at front and rear are 4mm each. I'll look up the torque settings Tony recommends and probably do away with the spacers.
Currently, I am battling to get the hydraulic pump leak proof (using a set of new rubber seals), but that's a different story.

Anton
Anton Piller

Anton,

To find the torque settings is a bit tricky!

Go to "Technical Centre"
Go to "Technical data"
Go to "Size Matters"
Go to "Nuts and bolts"
From that you will find that the rams at the rear have 3/8" BSF bolts, and the fronts are 5/16" BSF

Return to "Size Matters" page
Go to "Engine and other torque settings"
Go to "Generic torque settings"
Look up the size and type of bolts you have - 3/8" BSF require either 32.5 or 47.5 ft/lbs, and 5/16" BSF 18.5 or 25 ft/lbs.

Amazing what you can find out from this website!

No way will those torques distort your rams! Do not use spacers!

I reckon you could safely forget all this and just do them up as tight as you can by hand. I'd be surprised if anybody has ever used a torque wrench on these, ever!
N Wakeman

Thank you Neil and apologies if these locations are difficult to navigate to. I try to keep navigation simple, however with over 3.5GB of information now on the website, not everything can be at the front of the shelf.

To make it easier for anyone wanting to get to either of these location you give:

Nuts and Bolts can be downloaded from here - http://www.mg-cars.org.uk/imgytr/pdf/nutboltdbase.pdf

and the torque settings from here - http://www.mg-cars.org.uk/imgytr/pdf/reassycheck.pdf

Regards

Paul
Paul Barrow

Neil & Paul
Thank you for the interesting Lists to read - I am getting wiser by the day (hanky's to you)All I have to do now is to find outfit the bolts are standard- or high tensile steel. I do have a desk grinder and will compare the y's bolt with a cheap screw from a hard ware store. Presumably the sparks of a high tensile one will be darker than the softer version.
Regards, Anton
Anton Piller

This thread was discussed between 28/10/2016 and 01/11/2016

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