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MG MGF Technical - F hard top on a TF

Hi
My daughter has purchased a hard top. Probably from an F, it is black , smooth and very shiny.
She has fitted it to her TF. BUT there is a gap at the rear of the doorglass and the vertical seal of the hard top.

Can this be rectified by moving the window glass in its channel in the door ? Or has she bought a pup?

My MGF has a different make of hard top (with the water run off lips) and fits my F perfectly. so unable to advise her.
Rgds
AlanEJ
ALAN JONES

The early hardtop for the *F*s had different seals to later ones as the early *F* had a slightly larger glass area in the door windows.

But the *F* and *TF* will take the same hardtop it may just need new seals.
Ted Newman

yes , new seals required as confirmed by Dieter on his excellent mgf website
thanks
alan
Alan Jones

Thats strange,

I bought one of the original MGF's 4 years ago and it was 6 years old then. In checking the vin number it was one of very early models, and had the old softtop. I can't remember the exact number but was within 3 months of making them.

The first purchaser was obviously rich as he bought a wood weel, wood gear shift, different alloys, hardtop, hartop cover and boot rack.

4 years ago I bought the lot and last year sold it for a tf but kept the hardtop. The hardtop is black and shiny and it fits my tf 2003 model perfectly. I have it on at the minute, so don't see why yours doesn't fit.

It does pour water on your seat and trousers when you open the door though as no rain channels, which is a problem when you trun up for meetings with wet trousers and bum (as the seat is wet).

So now leave a towel over the seat to catch the water

Brian

Some adjustment of the catches can be required when moving a hardtop from one car to another - but there are few issues regarding fitting an MGF hardtop to a TF or vice versa.

I think that Dieter's site also has details on catch adjustment - or if you have a workshop manual, it's detailed in there.
Rob Bell

I concur with Brian, my 1996 hardtop fitted a TF just fine.
jt
John Thomas

Have a look at Dieters homepage:
http://www.lame-delegation.de/mgfcar.de/hardtop/convert.html

Cheers,
Sven
Sven Angelmahr

Hi
the window glass has been moved back a couple of mm. Gap is now a couple of MM. Rather than fit special brackets to reform the seal , or fit new seals it's been suggetsted that we wel lubricate some rubber hose and and insert it in the hollow bit of the seal. seems a good idea, Any thoughts?
any body got any 'ose?
Rgds alanEJ
AP Jones

Alan, the thin hose comes from B&Q. It is often suggested as a 'cure' for leaks, normally the windscreen pillars to cheater.
John Ponting

I'd leave it out.
The HT is one of the most expensive parts at this car and IMO not worth to play with.
I.e. From experiance reported by Bruce C. (2003 Email).

Such DIY tries don't last for a long time.

Bruce had an old HT put on his newer car and found it heavy leaking soon. The previous owner had cut the seal in any way and supported with some foam strips. Finally the foam just helped the water to get _in_ the car.
;)
Hi said aswell that the newest parts he bought in 2003 where different to those mentioned on my webside (State 2000).

However I wasn't able to look up superceeds of parts in 2003, .... but now I am.

Right hand seal of HT
DSF101060PMD Seal assembly-hardtop until WD027767
superceeded by DSF101280PMD

DSF101280PMD
from WD027768 until WD032470
and with no relation to superceeds
since WD032471 (strange !)

Than appears with no relation to superceeds
DSF000060PMD Seal assembly-hardtop
From YD531765 (strange !) (July 2001)

The LH seals are similar changes.

Then we have the Spacer brackets
DSZ100150 (2of) since WD027768
and another Spacer bracket (plate?)
DSZ100170 (2of) since WD032471
and Fibre Washers
EAM6543 (4 of) since WD027768

Finally one more Spacer bracket I did not get aware of earlier.
DSZ100160 Spacer-hardtop cantrail since WD027768 (so to support the rear rubber seal)

Conclusion:
Bruce had got the very latest seals, different to the procedure written to the bulletin I had in 2000.
http://www.mgfcar.de/hardtop/hardtop_M6932bu.pdf
(warked for me, though)

-- cut from Bruce email 11/2003 ----
So, as I understand, the modification shown in your website requires new type seals AND a special set of brackets which are rivetted to the hardtop. The brackets press against the seals to push them against the glass.

The seals I have purchased have 2 metal pieces inside the seal just like the rubber seal around the bottom of the door opening. It looks as if it clips onto the plastic(fibreglass?) edge where the original seal was. Is this the same as the new seal in your pictures? I have attached 2 photos to show the seal I have purchased.

..
...
Took the plunge two days ago and fitted one of the new side window seals to my 96 HT. It took longer to remove the old seal than to fit the new one. Fitting was very easy, no rivetts, and at the moment I am testing it in bad weather. I haven't even glued the ends of the seal yet and so far it all seems to be OK. It is certainly a great improvement on the original seal and the glass presses onto the rubber all round. I await some dry weather to fit the seal on the other side and glue the ends in properly. ...
---- end---

My apology to Bruce, I was much engaged with moving house and didn't realise the importance.
Anyway, here are his pics.
http://www.mgfcar.de/hardtop/bruce_2003_IMG_0321.jpg
http://www.mgfcar.de/hardtop/bruce_2003_IMG_0322.jpg
I assume thes are the latest P/N's?

@Bruce,
if you read, can you tell us more today ?
Did you only get this seals from the lady in Birmingham ?? No washers, no more brackets ?
Did it work reliable _seal_ for you ??

If so, then all should go for
DSF000060PMD Seal assembly RH
DSF000070PMD Seal assembly LH
????? and forget the earlier Bulletin ??

Regards
Dieter
PS *Advert*: join the MGF/TF World Map @ http://www.frappr.com/mgf :))
Dieter

I have a HT which I bought new in 1996 for my F. Traded F for TF in 2002 and kept the HT. A few (very) minor adjustments to window and fits fine with no need for adjustment between ST and HT.

Should be no need for new seals.

The only caveat I would add is that the rear backets on the HT have had at least 2 versions. The very early ones force the HT onto the rear apron and can damage the paintwork. With these the window fit is also inconsistent. The later ones cured this so check the rear catches.
David M

Just to reiterate - the very early hardtops had different seal to those fitted later - HOWEVER - good dealers swapped the seals for nothing if you left the hardtop on for a service. I don't think it was a 'recall' job but an MG Bulletin to dealers.

Ted Newman

Ted, wont dispute what you say, but the seals on my HT are the originals (circa 1996) and I have had no problems moving between the F and TF.
David M

David - have a look at the back edge of the hardtop (under the rear window) if it is a foam seal - then you are very fortunate that it fits the TF.

On the other hand if it is a normal type car door rubber seal then it is the newer seals and providing they have not 'collapsed' they should fit.
Ted Newman

Ted,
<<The early hardtop for the *F*s had different seals to later ones as the early *F* had a slightly larger glass area in the door windows<<

based on your quote above, I was assuming you were refering to the rubber seals around the windows (which do not need changing), rather the rear edge of the HT which fits to the boot apron.

My previously posted caveat
>>The only caveat I would add is that the rear backets on the HT have had at least 2 versions. The very early ones force the HT onto the rear apron and can damage the paintwork. With these the window fit is also inconsistent. The later ones cured this so check the rear catches. <<
described the change in the rear HT edge. Although the foam was removed, it was the changed rear catches that are the reason, not the foam itself. In this case I agree, don't go for the old version as they ruin the paintwork on the boot apron, and yes mine were replaced by my dealer.
David M

David my dealer changed the foam and the top seals as part of the bulletin instruction they DID NOT change the catches.
Ted Newman

Hi Dieter,

Yes my hardtop seals are fine and working OK. I bought them from Victoria at the MGF Centre. They just pushed on to the edge around the window opening and glued on at the corner point where the HT meets the screen. The bottom end of the seal sits on top of the door seal and the seal that runs around the lip under the rear window fits into the window seal mouldings.

They cost £60 for the two seals with VAT to add on top.

I guess the hardtop came from around the same era as my car; 1996 but it had been converted to the new type catches.

I sent you that email just as I was applying for a new job. The very same job that I am being made redundant from tomorrow! :-)) Two years ago almost to the day!

Some you win.....

Bruce
Bruce Caldwell

LOL - my hardtop is completely 100% original - exactly how the factory shipped it in 1996, complete with the original style catches (work fine) and original seals (including that rear deck one).

I suspect that the window seals probably need replacing, but other than that, it is fit for purpose :o)
Rob Bell

Rob - mine worked fine at the time BUT the dealer insisted on my putting the hardtop on when it went in for service so that he could change the seals - they (or rather he) was good and knew his stuff.
Ted Newman

I guess I probably missed this at the time, as the car would probably not be wearing its hardtop when it went back in for servicing.

That, and the fact that I'd moved away from the dealership that originally sold me the car.
Rob Bell

This thread was discussed between 11/11/2005 and 18/11/2005

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