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MG MGB GT V8 Factory Originals Technical - Engine Stabilizers

I finished the rebuild on my GTV8 in 1987 after fitting a 3.5L SD1 engine, keeping the standard SU carbs.
I am now uprating the car with new engine, Gbox, brakes, LSD, Suspension etc. and have noticed on removing the engine mountings, that the right hand mounting is approx 8mm thinner than the left, and has abviously been compressed by the movement of the engine against it.( this was a V8 mounting and not a 4cyl one )
Since 1987 I have only done approx 15k miles and the engine was only developing approx 145hp.
I have ordered new Stiffer mountings from Clive Wheatley but as my new 4.0L engine should be making in excess of 200hp I am concerned that the new mountings wont last very long.
Has anyone fitted an engine stabilizer? and if so where?
I was thinking of trying to rig something up from the rear of the left hand head across to the bulkhead. Maybe someone has adapted something from another vehicle.

Thanks in advance.
Mark Rawlins

Mark

I have built my own stabilizer bar which you should be able to see in the engine bay shots on:

www.mgcars.org.uk/v8_conversions

This is built to connect the LH (driver side) to the nearside bulkhead.

Regards

JB
John Bourke

Mark,

I also fitted an engine stabiliser and bought it from the V8 conversion compagny in the UK. I needed it because my altenator fan touched the oil filter.
Regards
Peter
Peter van de Velde

Thanks,
I found the picture very interesting.
I was hoping that I could do something without welding as I have already started to refit the engine. I will make enquiries with the conversion companies and see what I can adapt.
John. While looking at your work I noticed that you have twin brake master Cyls and one remote servo. How does this connect up?

OOps my rebuild was completed in 97 not 87

Cheers
Mark Rawlins

Mark,

I bought a tie bar kit about £40. This attaches to left side of engine to chassis. I made a reinforcing plate were it bolted to chassis and also moved expansion tank to rear of engine bay. Can't remember where I bought it though.

Paul
Paul Wiley

I replaced the mounts on my factory V8 a few years ago as part of a bigger job and noticed how much stiffer the new mounts were - seemed like a good thing. However a few years down the line some particularly hard accelleration in a low gear broke the LH rubber. Changed them both again and this time the new ones are noticeably softer. Did the stiffer mount break because it wasn't very flexible? Was it a baddun anyway? Who knows? Both sets came from Clive. A stabiliser would be of benefit, methinks.

PaulH.
Paul Hunt

Mark

re the brakes: the servo operates on the front circuit only. It's a special unit with only about 1;1.5 ratio and a linear pressure curve(high knee point) to raise the front circuit design pressure at 1G from around 650 psi to around 900 psi. You can only get so much pedal ratio into the footwell and it's not possible to achieve enough pressure without a servo or say 300to 350dia discs....

Regards

John Bourke
John Bourke

I too use a steady mounted beteen an unused threaded stud hole on the end of the left bank cylinder head down to a welded anchor point on the left chassis rail.

I initially used solid joints as they were handy from a competition suspension tie bar. This was a temporary arrnagment as I expected harshness to be transmitted from the engine to the chassis. 16 years on the same units are still in place as I have never felt or heard anything that pointed to this being a problem.

On the positive side by comparison of the twist on the engine without load (i.e. by simply blipping the throttle) with the steady connected and not connected the difference was considerable. I too have used genuine V8 mountings and incidentally suffered from a split developing on the nearside one as described by Paul.

I also saw a degree of settlement of the mountings as with new V8 rubbers, which do seem softer, the engine was now raised by a good 6mm. A small amount, but when your operating to a degree of 5mm or so for injection plenum to bonnet clearance that 6mm becomes an issue!

Rog
Roger Parker

I have used the engine tie bar form a Rover P6B. It comes with all rubber bushes and fits perfectly to a bracket fabricated to fit LH head. I had 3 spare bolt holes so have very secure mounting at that end. I mounted a 4mm X 60-100mm X 250mm plate to exterior side of inner wing spanning wing/inner wing join.
I have noticed considerable improvement (taughtness) in car since doing that. (3.9 engine)
Ross Hannah

As Paul says, hard mounts of the steady bar do not seem to transmit vibration through the car. I had an unused set of torque arms so I tied the motor down on each side directly to the front chassis rail. No difference in vibration or sound in the car (which is remarkably quiet). In my case (and I would guess in others' situations) there's not much clearance between the steering column and the exhaust, so it's mighty helpful to situate the motor where it's not going to move under any circumstances. Many happy miles later, no issues have arisen.

(I realize you really only _need_ one steady bar, on the driver's side, but since I had two I put one on either side ... doesn't hurt. Nope, that motor simply ain't goin' anywhere.)
Terrence

For the benefit of owners of right-hand drive cars for 'drivers side' read 'left-hand side'.

PaulH.
Paul Hunt

Hi Terrence,
Can you elaborate on how you installed this steady bar. I tried to install one on my 77RB but didn't work 100% .What materials did you use? and how is it tied in to the chassis rail? Any welding ?
Werner
PS.; Do you have pics?
Werner Van Clapdurp

Werner -- I am pretty sure you would be able to install what I have just fine in your '77, no welding. Basically right in front of each side of the front of the motor I have a vertical 1/4" steel rod with a pair of those torque arm ends on it. I'm not even sure what you call them ... but I mean the kind of things you can get from Summit Racing ... sort of a nylon-bushed eye ... I've always just called them torque arm ends. I think they are actually called Heim joints or rose joints or something. Hopefully you know what I'm talking about.

Anyhow, on each head there are some unused threaded holes ... you just fabricate a steel plate to bolt into them, and bolt the torque arm thing onto that. I had a local shop do this to my specs and it cost $20 for two plates. We are not talking about anything at all complicated.

As far as the chassis, you just bolt a piece of 1/4" steel plate to each side of each chassis rail and drill holes horizontally through the rails and those plates a few inches aft of the rad. The torque arms get bolted on there. No fancy fabrication necessary -- just get the shop to cut you some small pieces of the steel plate.

It couldn't be easier ... believe me, I'm no expert fabricator. I'm not even a terribly good mechanic, when you get right down to it. It is not all that easy or convenient to drill the holes in the chassis rails, but not impossible either. But this setup looks entirely finished and super clean. And the system does seem very, very, very strong. I wish I had a way to send some pictures but I don't even have an email account at the moment, let alone a digital camera.

Come to think of it, I can't give you a good reason to bother with the passenger-side one, but it doesn't seem to hurt.
Terrence

i have two observations on the comments so far.The method Ross Hannah used with the P6B steady bar I found under hard accelleration lifted the weight from the LH front wheel & tended to steer the car. I re-routed the the bar to the chassis rail so that it now mounts vertically. The method Terrence used is just bad engineering practise. If you drill holes through box sections, you should ALWAYS weld a tube between the holes to prevent the box section caving in when the bolt is tightened & to restore the original strength, in this case the chassis. Apologies to those concerned if I've misinterpreted any of their suggestions. Regards Barrie E
begerton@froggy.com.au

If I could weld, sure, I'd probably have gone for it. But with plates on either side, you'd have to tighten down on those bolts like King Kong to get the chassis rail to squash down. And they're not kept terrible tight. Also, chassis strength this far forward in the car (forward of x-member, engine mounts, everything important) is a non-issue ... IMHO one should be infinitely more worried about doing things farther back, like cutting out holes for RV8 exhaust ... potentially threatening the structural integrity of a good portion of the vehicle.
Terrence

It seems to me that in the case of engine steady bars, it would make sense to have two - one on either side. Here's why I think this: if you have just one, it's going to pull up on whatever side of the car it's attached to (in our case, as with most engines, the driver's side (passenger side for the Brits :-)). If you make the bar bigger or stiffer it's just going to pull on that wheel more. Having a bar on the opposite side as well is going to resist that force by transferring weight BACK to that side and the forces (hopefully) cancel out.

Here in the states I remember one of my cousins had (this was like 15 years ago) a Chevy Biscayne (pardon the spelling) which had a cable-type engine steadying system...on both sides. He showed it to me, revved the engine, and it works. At that moment it occurred to me why it had two and not just one, even though the engine is trying to rotate in just one direction.

At any rate, guess what kind of engine steady bar(s) my V8 will have? :-)

Of course I can be totally wrong, and it wouldn't be the first time, so take my rant with a grain of salt!

Joe Pitassi
Joe Pitassi

Of course, with a cable system it wouldn't work (the transferring weight), but you know what I mean. I'm sorry, it's late in the day! :-)

Joe Pitassi
joe pitassi

It would seem that with a reasonably high output engine some sort of engine stabilizer is a must.
After considerable contemplation I have succeeded in fabricating some simple brackets connected by a torsion bar with rubber mounts either end. ( actually I found a bar from a Mercedes truck part No. A974 320 01 90 which is about 2ft long and only £10).
My setup fits to the back of the right hand cylender head horizontally accross to the top of the left hand footwell. Looks really neat and out of the way.
I also managed to use these torsion bars as anti tramp bars with slight modification to the length.
Hopefully I will get to try my handywork soon.

Thanks to all.
Mark Rawlins

This thread was discussed between 10/01/2001 and 28/01/2001

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