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MG MGB GT V8 Factory Originals Technical - Oil Pump

When I rebuilt my 69 Rover 3.5 I drilled out the oil journals and added an up-rated oil pump from D&D. This set up has worked flawlessly since I installed it.
In the hope of eliminating the remote oil filter I installed a different oil pump cover. The new oil pump cover didnít work and so I re-installed the original oil pump cover. (The engine is in the car)
Now the pump gears are binding just as the bolts become slightly more than finger tight. (I know the torque setting is 10#ís, but these bolts are not reaching 10#ís before the gears bind).
Upon re-assembly I used a Felpro gasket #70032 (.007 - .008) between the spacer plate provided by D&D and the front cover assembly and another Felpro gasket between the spacer plate and the oil pump cover.
The only difference I can see is that I used an additional gasket between the spacer plate and the oil pump cover. If I remember correctly I didnít use one with the original installation. But since I have had oil leakage problems I decided to use one on this installation. Could this second gasket be the cause?
Also as I read through the instructions from D&D, it mentions ďGaskets are mated to spacer thickness in each kitĒ? Does this mean I have to buy a new gasket from D&D who is located on the other side of the country?

Bruce




Bruce Mills

I had thought they used a spacer in the uprated oil pumps on eary motorsie longer gears. Is there a shim or somthing missing. Perhaps you havent loosend the distributor prior to instaling the oil pump and its forcing the oil gear down?
Peter

Peter, Thanks for your reply. However there is a spacer between the front cover and the oil pump cover and there are no shims.
The distributor is out of the engine.

Bruce

Bruce Mills

Bruce:
I had similar problem when going to the high volume pump. The clearances are very tight inside the pump. The kit I used supplied a paper gasket for each side of the spacer plate. I test assembled the pump and everything worked great. I then dis-assembled the pump, spraying(.015" approx.)and baking on a water based dry film lubricant. On re-assembly, this was enough to bind the gears before all bolts were tightened. After removing most of the DFL by blasting with aluminum oxide, the pump worked OK.
If the gaskets you are using are thinner than the originals, this may be reducing the end clearance between the gears and the gear pocket housing. The Rover factory manual suggests placing a straight edge across the gears and checking the clearance between the straight edge and the gear housing. The manual states "if less than 0,05mm (0.0018") check the front cover gear pocke for wear" I can scan and send this page with diagrams if you like. Any chance of re-using the original gaskets?
I'll be in Schelt and Gibson's in early May (5/6th). If you're around I'd like to buy you a beer..........
Phil
Fredericton, NB

Phil O

Additional paper gaskets should give increased clearance I would have thought.
Paul Hunt

Well I have 3 gaskets, 2 are .008 and one is .006. Pretty close from a carpenters point of view.
The pump contained 1 at .006 and 1 at .008
I will try the 2 at .008 tomorrow after work and see if that allows the gears to move.
I will give D&D a call as well and see what they recommend.
The beer sounds great Phil. I look forward to your call. Are you staying in Gibson's or Sechelt, or just passing through?
Do you still have my phone number?

Bruce
Bruce Mills

I am having a lot of trouble with my up-rated oil pump and was wondering if anyone can shed any light on it.

A fellow V8'er out here on the West Coast gave me a oil pump cover which had a different angle on it, unfortunately once installed it would only allow about 1 1/2" long oil filter, so I replaced the gaskets and put the original oil pump cover back on. The oil pump gear then jammed
With the new gasket in place and the spacer plate for the up-rated oil pump, I checked with a straight edge across the gears and the gear housing. And the gap was too tight for a .002 feeler gauge to fit.

Now the manual says "if less than 0,05mm (0.0018") check the front cover gear pocket for wear"

Now it seems to me that the more the gear pocket was worn, the larger the gap would be with a straight edge across the gear and the gear housing, not less???? If the gear pump housing was worn, wouldn't the gears sit further in the gear pump housing recess making the gap between the gears and the gear housing greater???

Since I am using gaskets from the local auto store is it possible the gaskets aren't thick enough? They are @ .008.

If the gasket between the gear pump housing and the spacer plate was thicker, then the gap between the gear pump housing and the gears would be greater?

Any ideas greatly appreciated. There the car sits, every thing done and no oil pump.

Bruce




Bruce Mills

No, the gear wheels should stick up *above* the face of the front cover and the gap is filled by a gasket. As the pocket in the cover, or the end faces of the gear wheel wear, the gears will sink into the cover reducing that gap. With a gasket this will mean clearance for oil to 'short-circuit' past the ends of the gears and not go through the engine, which is why they quote a minimum figure. Conversely if the clearance is *bigger* than the thickness of the gasket i.e. the gears are too big for the pocket they will bind, but fitting replacement or additional gaskets to the correct thickness is easily done.
Paul Hunt

PS. Don't use sealing compound on the gaskets or this makes them thicker, and if they were the correct thickness in the first place it will simulate wear and low oil pressure.
Paul Hunt

Bruce
Are either of these gaskets poking inside the pump and catching the gears? Space is tight enough in there and I wonder if your tight clearance of 0.02 is due to the gears being restricted and held downwards by a small piece of gasket?
Dave
Dave Wellings

Thanks all for replies.
I contacted D&D and he said the same thing Paul, To stack gaskets until the gears protruded .002-.005 above the spacer plate. Then use the gaskets between the spacer plate and oil pump end cap to allow the gears to just spin freely when torqued to the proper setting.
Good suggestion Dave, I will take a look and MAKE sure the gasket is not binding the gears.
Pretty fine tolerances.

Thanks again

Bruce
Bruce Mills

This thread was discussed between 18/04/2004 and 29/04/2004

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