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MG MGB GT V8 Factory Originals Technical - On the road again,...
|Geez I can't get over how much power this car has. But best of all, I'll be able to drive it before cold weather sets in. Yeah, man!|
|Cograts Jim!I haven't forgot the power that car has!Hope you have many dry days driving before winter.Steve and I are heading to Battle of the Brits next weekend in Detriot.Hope it's dry!Mike|
|You know Mike, I've always been very impressed with your 300, ever since I first saw it in Indianapolis. It turns out my neighbor's brother has a 'surplus' 300 Buick boat engine in the barn that he might part with and I have the aluminum heads. On the Yahoo list I've seen where they've taken the 300 up to as much as 350 cu.in. My, oh my, the wheels are turning.... Wonder how hard it would be to adapt a 215 intake to the 300?...|
|Shouldnt be too hard to do that, you would have to have some spacers CNC cut that match the intake ports on the manifold to the heads, I would think its just a simple matter of geometry as both motors are 90 degree v8s and the 300 manifold is just a little wider than the 215. I thought there was a V8 newletter article dedicated to the 300 to 350 mods...|
Why adapt a 215 manifold? The aluminum 300 manifold that mates to the aluminum heads is not hard to find on E-bay, & I have a spare if you can't find one. On the other hand, if someone does make an adapter, remember you also have to make a valley pan for the 300, similar to the 215 valley pan. Also, make a second set for me, as I want to add fuel injection to my 300, & with an adapter, I could use the Rover intake instead of modifying a 300 intake.
Regarding expanding the 300 to 350- My shop neighbor has such a beast built by Dan @ D & D, & it was a lot of work. Fitting the 350 crank involved about 50 hours with a die grinder clearancing the block for the throws & rods. Nothing technically difficult, just time consuming.
Just out of curiosity, why did you choose a Buick 300 instead of a Ford 302? I'm not saying you shouldn't have, just wondering why. I know a lot about the 302, but very little about the 300, and what the relative merits of one are vs the other.
As an aside, the 302 can easily be taken up to 347ci without an excessive amount of clearance work. There are several kits available to do this, and complete stroker engines can be bought off the shelf, short or long block.
"On the Yaho list..."
Which groups is that? Thanks
|Maybe Jim is thinking of adapting his unique induction system to a bigger displacement engine.|
|My question was for Jim Stuart.|
I know you love the Ford EFI stuff, much as I do and you know it well (better than anyone I know personally) but I wonder if using the Holley FI systems would be easier in the future? Either the multiport Commander 950 based multiport system or the TBI system that mounts to any 4bbl carb location. The cool thing is that Holley has now released new harnesses that let you run DUAL Throttle bodies!! Meaning you get a nice big blower like yours that takes dual 4bbl carbs and slap two 900cfm Holley Projection TB's on it and off you go!! The 950 even handles timing and is 100% programamble just like a DFI system..
Or use thier multiport system that has the same ECU but uses normal injectors and TB..
And yes there are 347 kits requiring little to now change to the block and then there are I think some 393 kits out there that obviously take much work as they use Cleveland cranks or something like that... Alum heads and aftermarket EFI parts are plentifull... BUT Jim takes it on the unique and supremely cool factor.
When are you putting on the set of hairdriers to supplement the blower?? (logs off with a mischievus grin..)
|Why I chose a Buick 300 instead of a Ford:|
No issues against Ford, first of all. The real reason was Mike Moore made me do it. He also made me cut out the front frame rails to get a big (relative) aluminum radiator in, which I was going to need.
After driving Mike's 300, I saw how underpowered my Rover 4.2 was & decided my next conversion would really have some guts. The 300 was an obvious choice, as they were cheap, readily available, & I already had a set of aluminum heads. The fact that they are a bolt in using 215 mounts & could use parts I had on hand from 215's such as a front cover, distributer was also a factor. Ease of installation was definitely a factor. We were working on a conversion that Dave Mickel was doing using a rubber bumper GT and a 3.9 Rover before seeing & driving Mikes car. When we got back from the convention we scrounged a 300 lump, pulled the 3.9 from Dave's car & the 300 dropped right in with no clearance issues anywhere. Even the RV8 headders were a fit, & the hood cleared the 500 cfm Edelbrock & air cleaner without a bulge. I used the RV8 hood simply because I liked the look.
As far as "cheap" goes, that concept went out the window after talking to Dan Lagru. He likes the 300, but said the '64 was really strangled with the small valves in the aluminum head. A lot of money later, the aluminum heads were better breathers than the later iron heads with some very oversized valves & modified combustion chambers. This is not a requirement, as Mike's car had pleanty of power with reasonably stock heads.
|No offense intended Jim S, not by any means. I almost have no room to talk as mine has been off the road more than on in the last 3 years. I am honestly wondering why I ever opted to go EFI on mine. Mind you it is alsmot done, but damn has it taken a long time. and still alot more to do. Now the truck is down, so It may be even longer., I am contemplating a change back to a Carter/Edelbrock card for th car just so I can enjoy it. That or a used Holley TBI system..|
|Hi guys, just got back. So, yeah, I think I want to keep the EFI and blower, it is supposed to be big enough for a 5.7L engine, so a 350 would be feasible. Of course, just the 300 would be almost a 50% boost in displacement so, I mean we're already well into the realm of total insanity with that. Maybe, just maybe there'll be enough power to offset the weight penalty. What d'ya think Mike, maybe so? The guy said he'd take 3 bills for the mill and that sounds OK for an engine in good shape. |
Greg, I was thinking about the 215V8 group. I don't go there a whole lot but they did have some threads on it.
Larry, I just completed a MegaSquirt install on my truck and have been playing with that. It's a speed/density system and is surprisingly easy to tune compared to the Ford EEC-IV/tweecer combo. But, I'll get insurance on the car in the next day or so and will resume tuning there, which should give me some valuable comparisons between the two. It'll be interesting to see how they stack up. Btw, I rerouted the trigger circuits away from the ignition wires and expect that will cure the surge problem I was having before. Should know in a couple of days.
Dan, didn't Jim have a 215 in his car? That's the best explanation you could want for why a 300 and not a 302. It's not a conversion, just an upgrade.
|I'm thinking a vortech f-trim sitting in front of a rover 4.2 with about 9.0:1 compression could make some aggressive power. If I added one of their intercoolers up front too (with the water tank in the trunk) I could probably get to 400 flywheel hp without trying too terribly hard.|
If I tried for closer to 9.5:1 or 10:1 compression and lowered the boost would that make for a more reliable engine? I'm tempted to think it would.
(Just thinking out loud)
|I don't know about the reliability but it should help your gas mileage. |
Larry, I was out for a bit today, turns out the old surge problem is still there so it's not from feedback from the ignition wires. Next I'll cut the fans and try it again but I'm pretty sure I've already done that. Something is causing the injector pulsewidth to go nuts at 2 grand. Think I'll run by the ford dealer and ask if they've ever seen that. The car's running hot. It could be from insufficient advance, I haven't looked at it yet, but suspect that. Other than that it's running great, couldn't ask for better. And the ricers are about twisting their necks off!
My Buick 300 is a conversion, starting with a 1973 GT bodyshell, not an upgrade. Sorry you could not be at Grand Rapids. My roadster does have a 215 with Rover fuel injection. My old GT had a 4.2 Rover.
I did have to work a bit on the firewall, as the '73 does not have the "V8" engine bay, but the install was so much easier than the 5.0 Ford, according to those who have done it, & that was the main reason for using the Buick. No crossmember mods, off the shelf 1 5/8" headers, stock 300 front cover, standard conversion motor mounts. With a rubber bumper car it would have been even easier.
While the Buick 300 may not be everyone's choice, it is the easiest way to 300 hp, & probably the cheapest.
I heard that! Had I known about the weight differences a couple decades ago I'd have probably gone the same route.
|Jim, the ricers are fun, but the 50 something vette driver's are the best. heh they think they own the road and know what power is heh|
Let me know what you find out on the B and the MS. I have seen that for a few years and last I heard they were working on spark also. I have a source for a $150 Ford Factory SD system, lower intake to ECU. OHH I now have another 5.0 project seeing that my truck motor died heh This winter it may very well push the truck aside in terms of priorities. :-( So I better get working ont he MG while I can heh
|"Had I known about the weight differences a couple decades ago I'd have probably gone the same route."|
What are the weight differences?
|IIRC Mike said it was 80-100 lbs heavier than the 215. About the same weight as the 302. I'm sure Jim S has the exact figures.|
Larry, that'd be the MS-II, has spark and IAC. should be out in a month or so.
This thread was discussed between 03/09/2004 and 10/09/2004
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